Hey everyone, I've been offline for quite a while (my computer has
had major problems - I think [crosses fingers] I've got them all
solved now). Anyway, among other things, I lost all my LT scores,
playbacks, etc., so I guess I have to start over. Ok, I probably
don't HAVE to, but I'm obsessive that way. :)
On the high score question, I honestly can see the point of how it
is set up now, but I also confess frustration at occasionally having
what I believe to be a 'better' high score on a level, and it
doesn't count. Suyono, your responses, as always, are intelligent
and instructive; I think that if a change was implemented, the 'zero
shot problem' would simply be a matter of "If # of shots=0, sole
criterion becomes # of moves". However, I would most likely favor a
change as an addition of the two (moves & shots), in which case,
the 'zero shot problem' would not be an issue. I'm not sure that a
change is necessary, though it would be nice to have nearly 'double'
the challenges, as I believe someone described it (gerry?).
I hadn't thought of the 'traveling salesman problem' parallel;
that's an astute observation, though as that is one of the classic
problems I thought I loathed, and I love Laser Tank, perhaps I
should look again at it.
I do have a suggestion I've been meaning to bring up; could there be
an option to turn on/off mouse use in the game? I ask because I've
noticed that if I use it too much, I start getting pretty lazy about
my approach to the levels (sometimes I want to be lazy, of course).
I've also noticed a few levels created specifically, it seems, in
ways to prevent mouse use, which I understand, but find truly
irritating at times, since it can obscure the visuals to have so
many individual square tank movers (the usual on these levels).
I admit to being a little amazed at the numbers of levels some
people create; we who also love Laser Tank, but stink at making new
levels salute you. <grin>
Wulfbear
--- In [email protected], "Suyono H. Yaphar" <suyonohy@d...>
wrote:
shots' in LaserTank is different with `number of pushes' for some
reasons: 1) shooting can be done from a distant, 2) shooting can be
done indirectly (using mirrors), 3) pushing the blocks in Sokoban is
a must (objective of the game) while in LaserTank reaching the flag
is the objective of the game.
Like a classic problem, `Traveling salesman', which
requires `shortest distant' as the measure of winning, LaserTank
requires `number of moves' as the primary measure. `Number of shots'
is not a good primary measure for high score. Many levels need 0
(zero) shot in reaching the flag, so high score should be decided by
tie breaking using secondary measure (`number of moves'). On the
other hand, no level can be solved in 0 (zero) move. The objective
of the game is reaching the flag that requires at least one move.
Reaching the flag with the least nonzero `number of moves' is the
most logical choice.
Sokoban is different. The pusher should go to the block and push it
to the destination area. (No level can be solved in zero push.) So
pushing (not shooting) can be the most important measure. (Pushing
is the main business in Sokoban; meanwhile moving {to the flag} is
the main business in LaserTank.) I'm not surprised if `number of
pushes' must be minimized as one option to win the high score in
Sokoban.
Well, it's just one opinion. I'm always open with other ideas.
Bye,
Suyono H. Yaphar
had major problems - I think [crosses fingers] I've got them all
solved now). Anyway, among other things, I lost all my LT scores,
playbacks, etc., so I guess I have to start over. Ok, I probably
don't HAVE to, but I'm obsessive that way. :)
On the high score question, I honestly can see the point of how it
is set up now, but I also confess frustration at occasionally having
what I believe to be a 'better' high score on a level, and it
doesn't count. Suyono, your responses, as always, are intelligent
and instructive; I think that if a change was implemented, the 'zero
shot problem' would simply be a matter of "If # of shots=0, sole
criterion becomes # of moves". However, I would most likely favor a
change as an addition of the two (moves & shots), in which case,
the 'zero shot problem' would not be an issue. I'm not sure that a
change is necessary, though it would be nice to have nearly 'double'
the challenges, as I believe someone described it (gerry?).
I hadn't thought of the 'traveling salesman problem' parallel;
that's an astute observation, though as that is one of the classic
problems I thought I loathed, and I love Laser Tank, perhaps I
should look again at it.
I do have a suggestion I've been meaning to bring up; could there be
an option to turn on/off mouse use in the game? I ask because I've
noticed that if I use it too much, I start getting pretty lazy about
my approach to the levels (sometimes I want to be lazy, of course).
I've also noticed a few levels created specifically, it seems, in
ways to prevent mouse use, which I understand, but find truly
irritating at times, since it can obscure the visuals to have so
many individual square tank movers (the usual on these levels).
I admit to being a little amazed at the numbers of levels some
people create; we who also love Laser Tank, but stink at making new
levels salute you. <grin>
Wulfbear
--- In [email protected], "Suyono H. Yaphar" <suyonohy@d...>
wrote:
> I agree that `number of pushes' in Sokoban is very important so itcan be used as the primary measure for high score. But `number of
shots' in LaserTank is different with `number of pushes' for some
reasons: 1) shooting can be done from a distant, 2) shooting can be
done indirectly (using mirrors), 3) pushing the blocks in Sokoban is
a must (objective of the game) while in LaserTank reaching the flag
is the objective of the game.
Like a classic problem, `Traveling salesman', which
requires `shortest distant' as the measure of winning, LaserTank
requires `number of moves' as the primary measure. `Number of shots'
is not a good primary measure for high score. Many levels need 0
(zero) shot in reaching the flag, so high score should be decided by
tie breaking using secondary measure (`number of moves'). On the
other hand, no level can be solved in 0 (zero) move. The objective
of the game is reaching the flag that requires at least one move.
Reaching the flag with the least nonzero `number of moves' is the
most logical choice.
Sokoban is different. The pusher should go to the block and push it
to the destination area. (No level can be solved in zero push.) So
pushing (not shooting) can be the most important measure. (Pushing
is the main business in Sokoban; meanwhile moving {to the flag} is
the main business in LaserTank.) I'm not surprised if `number of
pushes' must be minimized as one option to win the high score in
Sokoban.
Well, it's just one opinion. I'm always open with other ideas.
Bye,
Suyono H. Yaphar